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DRP: Derbi Reactivation Project

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toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Running into issues

Post by toratora » Wed Nov 11, 2015 3:39 pm

I'm at the point where it's starting to show what it will be like when it's finished. It's all very exciting. However, I keep getting drawn away by other events, so it's being extended. Little progress here, little progress there...

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The side fills look like they will work out great, even following the curve of the frame. This is one of those happy coincidences. :)

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There are somethings that appear to be intersecting--unfortunately. The lower skirts will have to be trimmed at the side stand, and behind the rear brake where it looks like it will come in contact with the swing arm. Also it seems to be centering a bit on the throttle side of the bike. This could be related to the plastics contacting the side stand mount.

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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: ひだりに

Post by toratora » Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:39 pm

Get the left side together today. Progress has slowed down a bit because of the other things going on. The interesting thing is how stable the plastics are even without all the brackets in place. And while I still have a ways to go it is so since to see it all coming together.

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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Plated or Cast?

Post by toratora » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:39 pm

I saw this article today about cylinder plating. It's a worthwhile read, and goes a long way towards explaining why you want to be running a plated cylinder rather than cast iron. ;)

98winter_snowtech_article.pdf
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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Assume the Position!

Post by toratora » Thu Nov 19, 2015 3:39 pm

Started placing the engine in the cradle. Need to do this in order to see how the pipe is going to interact with the plastics. The front engine mount is a bit tight. This is due to the tolerances getting a bit tight when the crack was repaired.

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The rear mount on the GPR is nicer than on an old style RS because it isn't through the swing arm bolt. There is a coupler that sits between the swing arm mounts. You do need to loosen the swing arm bolt, 22mm skinny socket required, to rotate the coupler. Notice how the swing arm has a notch for the coupler to rotate into position. These Derbis are classy bikes--and people wonder why I prefer the Derbi to the Aprilia. :lol:

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Soon! By the way it is a lot easier to insert the engine without the spark plug installed. ;)

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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Tubes

Post by toratora » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:39 pm

Got some more things done. The engine is now sitting in place with the bolts. I mounted the pipe, and it looks like there are some issues with it, and the plastics.

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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Twist and Turn

Post by toratora » Fri Nov 20, 2015 3:39 pm

Putting 2004 plastics on the 2005 is quite a challenge. So many interesting challenges keep showing up. Like the pipe and the plastics. It looks like a bit of twisting and turning and the pipe will fit in most of the plastics will clear. Although it's a bit close in some places.

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The stock pipe mount was getting in the way of placing the pipe in a location that would work. With a bit of reangulation via a crescent wrench.

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Then things started clearing.

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I'm probably going to have to come up with some sort of mounting bracket.

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Oh the Jolly Moto. :)

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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Nightmare

Post by toratora » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:39 pm

Not exactly sure about placement yet, because I still have to trim the plastics, but I have a pretty good idea about what will be going on. :)

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On another note, does anyone know what the couple sitting back to back represent? All the other stock images on the Derbi panels I get, but that one eludes me.
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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Sensors

Post by toratora » Mon Dec 07, 2015 3:39 pm

Back on the first page of this thread I posted about sensors. This bike has a bit of a ways to go so I keep doing the research with regards to sensors. I've come across some interesting things. The MA cats discovered a really inexpensive way of doing EGT, which I think is an amazing DIY project. I've also found out about two more interesting Kart gadgets. The first, and probably most attractive is the Starline Corsare, but there is also the Alfonse setup. Lets see if I can properly cover these in a post, or three. ;)

I'll start off with the inexpensive setup. The whole setup is pretty much laid out in this Instructables. The dude even made a PDF of the setup. (You can also read about this in this MA thread.) The one rather glaring disadvantage with this system is the sample rate. It's something along the order of 4 time per second. This might not be enough to catch a really quick malfunction, but should be good enough to help you zero in on a really good tune.

He found a digital temperature gauge, and a K type thermal sensor. Taking a couple of these gauges, and getting creative with the sensors you can gave both EGT, and Head temp. Now he does it with a spark plug for head temp, but you could just as easily employ the sensor with a water temp sensor. These things can be found on eBay for less than around $25 for both gauges, and sensors. You'll probably want to make up a project box with in which to house them.

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Here is his parts list:

1 - K TYPE 6MM THREAD THERMOCOUPLE PROBE TEMPERATURE MEASUREMENT SENSOR 0-800℃ 1M
1 - CHT K type Thermocouple Temperature Sensors for Cylinder Head Temperature (14mm)
1 - Maplins project box
1 - Maplin Rectangular illuminated rocker switch N84JZ
1 - Thermocouple Red Digital LED 0-999C Temperature Thermometer Panel Meter Display
1 - Thermocouple Blue Digital LED 0-999C Temperature Thermometer Panel Meter Display.
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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Starlane Corsaro K

Post by toratora » Mon Dec 07, 2015 3:39 pm

The Starlane Corsaro K is another kart dash module. This one has some extremely cool features. The dash and the connectors to the sensors are housed in two separate physical units that communicate via Bluetooth. The dash will also communicate to your computer via Bluetooth to upload data. The remote even has a mini solar panel on it so you don't have to charge the battery. The main control of the dash is via its touch screen.

The next innovative feature is the ability to take your track routes and overlay them on to satellite maps. Why is this cool? Because by combining them you can see which paths through the section of the tracks are faster. What? That is so cool, but they didn't stop there. You can upload your lap, and compare it with other people's laps. So you buddy could post his hot lap to teach you how to improve. You can also take video of your ride, and then overlay captured data into the video.

And yeah there's all the other bits you'd like to have in such a system like EGT, and CHT sort of stuff. Plus GPS, RPM, oh and least I forget--it will infer your transmission gear based on speed and RPM. Yeah this is one cool box that is setting a pretty high water mark for its competitors.

Near as I can tell the software only runs on MSW, which is sad, but you can probably run it in a virtualizer if you don't have a crapy OS machine. :lol: It can be DLed from here.

Why the K? The K is for the kart version, which has two temp sensors, and RPM. The other ones have more features, but the price goes up. You can expect to pay just under $500 for this dash setup. From what I've read that would include one sensor. But you can get a K type sensor from lots of places. :)

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Here's a video in German explaining, well something. :P


Here it is installed on a bike to give you some idea of scale.

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Here's an overlay video.


Map overlay action.

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There are some different screen layouts, and even a fancy color screen version in the Pro model.

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User avatar
toratora
Posts: 3161
Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2017 1:05 am
Location: San Francisco
Replica: Derbi GPR
Cagiva Mito
Cobra CX65
Aprilia RS50
x 1768
x 1977
Contact:

DRP: Alfano

Post by toratora » Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:39 pm

Alfano makes a number of units for these applications. The Pro3 goes for about $300, but that looks to be without sensors. Still it would provide RPM, and two temps sensors, one of which would be a K type which could be used for EGT. So if you were to do your own wiring it might be viable. Otherwise if you buy their sensors it jumps up well over $500. Ouch! The Alfano ADM4 is a step up, and more like the Corsaro with the sensor box separated to a Bluetooth input box. Interestingly the ADM4 isn't all that much more than a Pro3. Looks like it goes for about $330, and again all sensors look to be extra.

There also seems to be a few software packages available to over lay data onto video. One package is called RaceRender, another one is called DashWare. I haven't done more than notice that these were available.
A1020 PRO III EVO

Our most reliable system yet! The PRO III EVO is the outcome of tireless testing and valuable customer feedback.

This system can stand alone with basic functions such as the taking of lap time, RPM, 2 temperatures (K and NTC type), and speed with a sensor. It can also be upgraded by connecting our GPS4 Module (sold separately). *See Options / Capabilities below, next to specifications.

Package includes:
1- PRO III EVO Alfano system
1- Magnetic Lap Time Sensor OR Infrared Receiver
1- RPM Sensor
2- AA Batteries
Alfano ADM4
This latest kart lap timing system from Alfano uses Bluetooth technology which means there are no wires needed to connect to the display unit itself. Instead a separate box with 4 inputs is remotely mounted on the kart to which the sensors are connected. The data is then sent to the display via Bluetooth.
Lap timing is via a magnetic sensor which uses the magnetic strips embedded in the race track. The inbuilt memory records up to 100 laps which can be reviewed on the display after each session.
9 LEDs across the top of the unit display RPM limits or Lambda (separate sensor and box required) and two additional LEDs at the side of the unit alert to high temperature or pressure (separate sensor and box required).

Alfano ADM4 Features:

Lap timing to 1/100th second
Data recording 5 / 10 / 20 Hertz
9 LEDs – RPM / Lambda
2 LEDs – Temperature / Pressure
5 Engine time counters
Bluetooth connectivity
Water resistant to IP56
Backlight
Dimensions: 133.5 x 90 x 28 mm
Screen: 77 x 45 mm / 160 x 94 pixels
Weight: 253 grams
Alfano Input Box ABX4 Features:

1 x Display input (BUS)
1 x Magnetic / Infrared timing input
1 x RPM input (max 30,000 rpm)
1 x Temperature input (max 1000 deg C)
Water resistant to IP56
Dimensions: 85 x 88 x 54 mm
Weight: 185 grams
Powered by 2 x AA batteries (included)

Software overlays
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